Interview with Robert Hunter and Greg Anton, August 25, 1997

The Maestros Work on a New Song

RH

Maybe it's time to demonstrate. How 'bout those changes?

Greg

The reason I brought it over today is I'm not sure how....

RH

You can let it roll. [pointing to tape recorder]

Greg

So let's see.

[G plays piece through]

RH

Could you play the main figure just one time through, so they don't bleed into each other?

Greg

Actually, I've got an A, B, and C part to this thing, and I could stretch any one of them out to make a verse. I was trying to do something a little different. So here's the intro, the "top" or whatever couple of verses: [playing]. So that's like one part.

RH

OK.

Greg

And then, I had two ways. I had it going in the same rhythm: [playing], or we could go with a half-time bridging kind of thing: [more playing].

RH

You mean this instead? Oh no, the other, the first one, and I'd repeat that figure three times. I'd give it about three repetitions because those'll be a strong voice in there, for a statement.

Greg

Well, then OK, but I'm going to go back and at the end of it: [playing, elegiac ending]. This is the last time.

RH

Say on the third repetition, play a higher-end version to make it a little bit different [sings to demonstrate].

[G accompanies R on piano, they come to a crescendo]

RH

That's interesting!

Greg

Yeah, [keeps playing], that's an old version I had, about three days ago.

A Hanging, Suspended Chord Could Be Nice

RH

And then a big, nice suspended chord to add it all off, a suspension.

[G plays]

RH

Let the suspension hang a little and then go into your C part.

Greg

[plays with hanging suspension] Like that? A half-step up?

RH

Yeah, and then move into whatever your C part is, or your chorus line or something like that. That really gives it some simplicity and power down in that B point, where you can actually say something and then resolve into whatever's going to happen in the C part. Could be nice, could be nice.

Greg

Well, you've answered all my questions, man, because now I'd like to go back to work.

RH

All right!

Greg

I can stretch those things out and make 'em.... You like that power chord thing rather than the half-time minor thing?

RH

Yeah, I can hear the band just leaning into it. And then you could get your half-time stuff into the middle of the C section, maybe even into the A section, whatever seems right, but I think the B section there, having that much meat in it, and then a suspension, you could say something.

Greg

I've been working a lot on this thing, and after working on it so much, I'm going, "Man, I need a change-up." Maybe I don't need a change-up. You know, I'm going "Oh shit, I've gotta do something totally different, half-time or something," because it's starting to get to me that it was too repetitious, but if it just can rock all the way through...

RH

Repetition's not going to do any harm at all there because I'll lay something on it, you know? And it'll just give it some gravity.

The A, B, C's of a New Song

Greg

Let me show you, then, one time through, and it'll be fairly brief, I don't want to spend a long time on each section.

RH

Could you say "A," "B," and "C" as you go through the different ones so I don't get lost in it?

Greg

Yeah, so here's A: [plays]. OK, here's the B: [keeps playing] ... C! [Plays final section, then singing] Back to A.

RH

You might want to mate that suspended chord in the earlier section to one at the end of the C section or B section. I don't know what section you got there. Mate it to another one. I love "sus" chords. They just give you all that traveling space and more room to whip around in there too.

Greg

Well check this out. It could go: [plays], sus chord [keeps playing].

[R walks to piano and starts playing single-finger on the high end of the piano, takes a few notes to find the key, and then starts improvising a melody, somewhat reminiscent of All Along the Watchtower.]

Greg

Yeah, some kind of melody like you were just plunking there, or something like that. It turned out stronger... I think it's going to be a rock song, you know? a rockin' song.

xian

Instead of a ballad?

Greg

Yeah. We were talking about doing a ballad.

RH

That ain't a ballad.

Greg

No.

xian

Would that B section repeat then? When you played it A, B, C, you played it through once, but is it gonna repeat a couple times through?

Greg

Yeah, it'll probably go a couple times through. I find when I play instrumentally, just to repeat and repeat something without any words makes it seem too long, but then when I get the words, it makes total sense. For example, we do three verses of Catalina before we do a bridge. We were gonna do the third verse after the bridge - two verses after the bridge - but now we do three verses, a bridge, and one verse, and I love the way we push it and push it. I really like the tension that creates. Now if you play Catalina on a piano, all that length, from the beginning to the bridge, just goes on forever.

How to Write a Song

xian

For composing, do you mainly just sit at a piano, and mess around?

Do you a have method?

Greg

I was looking for the right note, and when I finally got it, I knew it immediately

I work for hours and hours and hours on this thing before I bring it over here, and still it's like floundering around.

xian

When I said "mess around," I didn't mean to imply that it's not together. I'm not a musician so I wouldn't know the first thing you would do. Play a note? Play a chord? a phrase?

Greg

I had this thing right here: [plays first chord, holds it, plays second and third], and I liked the sound of it. So then I had this variation: [plays original and variation], and I liked the way those create some kind of tension back to back. I got real excited when I came up with the second thing, and it took me two weeks to come up with that, not 24 hours a day, but every time I was near a piano.

I bang around, basically. I play drums on a piano. When I'm working on a melody, and I've just been noticing this the past couple years, it'll go [plays the melody of Gregg's Egg's, first two phrases], you know that melody, to Gregg's Egg's? I sat there [plays first half phrase] and plunked along in my slow way forever, but I was looking for the right note, and when I finally got it (snaps fingers) I knew it immediately.

This thing right here, where it goes like this [phrases of new tune, with suspensions, then hits higher chord], when I came across that, I really liked it, and I'm not sure where exactly it goes [plays up to higher still]. Something like that and probably [restates and finds turnaround back to original phrase, then repeated with triumphant air and melodic trills, not unlike the watchtower-y "solo" Hunter tinkled earlier, then trails down.]

In this particular tune, I'm trying to create the release between minor and major so it goes minor, minor, minor, major--like, ta-da! I'm trying to make it sound like that: Ta-da!

Close Enough for Jazz

RH

Remember that last thing that you gave me, last year? I couldn't do anything. There just wasn't a place to creep in. All the available space was taken with inventive stuff, which is fine for a jazz band. What I said that time was, "Get Kimock or something on it to give me a clear shot past that rhythm and inventiveness in it."

Greg

Well, that's what I learned: to try anything out, sometimes I'll do some flourish or something, but I'm just trying to keep... [plays first phrase, beats time twice, second phrase, beat, continues]. Now what I can finally do [keeps playing], is do that again [keeps playing]...

RH

Good.

Greg

... and then double it. [plays to demonstrate], one more time, [plays], no wait, [plays through], now... [plays, with suspensions, higher chord, again, again, again but now steps up to major, and back to original phrase], like that, and then do that around again, you know, two or four times, and maybe then, by the time we've done all that, we could go to this half-time bridge, and just have more time in the song: [plays half-time bridge, through and back to first phrase].

RH

That might be a nice place actually to put a guitar figure rather than words. I could hear a counter-guitar figure without words messing with your playing at that point.

Greg

And give those words a kicker.

RH

Yeah, you're just looking for a countermelody. I wouldn't fancy that the words would be paralleling what you're doing there as much as finding a hook into a melody, up above, that those [chords] are laying the ground for.

xian

I'll keep my ears open at shows.

Greg

Who knows what's gonna happen? You never know. It goes through so many changes.